Developing routines

[B-natural]

Originally Posted by celc5

The pec is a different beast than the biceps, triceps, hams, or quads. These are 2 joint muscles where you have the ability to manipulate slack vs. stretch. Only ROM dictates slack vs. stretch in the pec.

According to my aforementioned philosophy, pec variation is more easily accomplished by varying the ANGLE at which you hit the muscle. Changes in angle address different fibers to a greater extent (note that I did not say isolate because that can't be done IMO).

The flat bench pec moves elicit the most effecient contraction. Although decline will be stronger because of should joint mechanics and the large lats playing a secondary role in this move (which is another topic).

I'm not a fan of flyes. When the elbow travels below the plane of the shoulder, there is a very fine line where the pec becomes overstretched. This puts the pec at such a disadvantage that the shoulder stabilzers must pick up the relatively enormous load when the pec surrenders. Next up for damage is rotator cuff and joint capsule/labrum.

Second reason that I'm not a fan of flyes is that it's so easy to rest at the top of the movement. Traveling with the DB's past the frontal plane of the shoulders gives the pecs a rest when you should actually be reaching a solid squeeze. CCO's keep constant tension and are a better choice IMO.

*Celc's tip for presses: warm up through full, and if pain free, exaggerated range. I'd stay as close to 90 degrees elbow and shoulder flexion as you can to avoid serious injury when piling on the weights. Pec tears and shoulder injuries occur most prevalently on an incline activity followed by flat. Least likely to occur during declines.

Are you suggesting to stay near 90 deg.s for things like DB BB flat/Inc bench pressing? If so, I see this as something that would mainly stimulate the triceps and front delts and have only minor effects on the pecs. On both inc and flat bench I come down to my chest, which is deeper than 90deg. Of course I believe its elbow flexion thats 90 deg. and with my hands spread outside of shoulder width, it does stay within a close range of 90deg. haveta scope it out next press day. As for the flyes, I usually use cables on the cybex and use 2-3 diff arm positions (arms of cybex, not my own)

[celc5]

In my opinion, when doing your heaviest sets of flat and incline presses, touching the bar to your chest puts you at some risk for shoulder and pec injuries for the aforementioned reasons. Use caution and don't get sloppy when you're going that deep because injuries can happen to anyone.

I'm not sure about the mechanics of the top 1/2 of the pressing movement. You've stumped me on that one, as I don't recall concrete material to justify a response.... although, common knowlege says triceps take the brunt of the laod at the top of the press, I'm not sure if I agree or disagree with that one.

[B-natural]

I just know that ppl tend to let their shoulders come forward towards the end of a press to finish the rep and the triceps are also heavily stimulated near the end of the rep. I'd haveta look it up to find %'s of stimulated muscles. Good info though, i'll keep the tips in mind as I'm favoring a weak elbow ATM