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Thread: Injectable Prohormones?!

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    Default Injectable Prohormones?!

    I have been searching around and seen a lot of information on prohormones..lots of information over oral use, but initially I was wondering what prohormones can be injected, if any?

    Thanks in advance for any input!

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    I know a guy who is making IM sdrol, epistane,msten,etc.
    ---- I D L E H A N D S ----

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    Quote Originally Posted by n0L3n View Post
    I know a guy who is making IM sdrol, epistane,msten,etc.
    Which is a waste of time, since they are all orally bioavailable. I'm not sure why anyone would inject most designer steroids.






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    Quote Originally Posted by n0L3n View Post
    I know a guy who is making IM sdrol, epistane,msten,etc.
    Which is a waste of time, since they are all orally bioavailable. I'm not sure why anyone would inject most designer steroids.






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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Hook View Post
    Which is a waste of time, since they are all orally bioavailable. I'm not sure why anyone would inject most designer steroids.
    Exactly. That's why you don't see that shit around. Might as well try drinking a vial of test.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Hook View Post
    Which is a waste of time, since they are all orally bioavailable. I'm not sure why anyone would inject most designer steroids.
    Why wouldn't you gain some bioavailability though?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleAddict83 View Post
    Why wouldn't you gain some bioavailability though?
    It would be akin to complaining about losing a milligram of testosterone in the barrel of a pin.






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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Hook View Post
    It would be akin to complaining about losing a milligram of testosterone in the barrel of a pin.
    Interesting.

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    Trest- both sold in pill by ph companies and inject by research labs

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Hook View Post
    Which is a waste of time, since they are all orally bioavailable. I'm not sure why anyone would inject most designer steroids.
    Oooh... You're way off brother. Don't mock it til you try it.

    So it's orally bioavailable through methylation, but does that mean it is 100% orally bioavailable? After passing through the stomach and then making a first liver pass? And then a second liver pass? This cannot be said for a single hormonal compound that I am aware of. Are you?

    Let's take Superdrol for instance, since it's a nice round number: 10mg.

    Say it's got 85% oral bioavailability, for argument's sake, which is pretty high relatively. So for every cap you ingest orally, you're getting 8.5mg. In 3 caps, you're losing 4.5mg - nearly half a cap. You're not just "losing a milligram in the tip of a syringe" out of the 250mg of Test E that it takes to put on 20lbs of lean mass (1/250 by proportion). You're losing at least 5mg out of 30mg of SD (1/6 by proportion). 1/250 vs. 1/6 - you do the math.

    But if you inject 10mg, you are getting 10mg. Inject 30mg, and you are getting 30mg (it's a base, non-esterified compound, so there is nothing lost due to ester weight).

    But what else? Don't discount the effect on your body by having a methylated compound hit your liver 200% more by orally ingesting it than by injecting it, because when you inject it, you're bypassing the first liver pass. Therefore, science tells us (as well as anecdotal reports by this point) that it is in fact less toxic. Half as toxic? Certainly not. But inarguably less toxic.

    Cliff's notes... Eat 30mg of Superdrol to get 25mg of methasteron and have your liver feel like it got hit with 30mg of methasteron. Inject 25mg of methasteron to get 25mg of methasteron and have your liver feel like it got hit with 20mg or less of methasteron.

    A waste? You're off base here brother.

    The other factor is the immediacy of kick in time when injected. Ever inject TNE and feel it begin to work in your body immediately and provide the absolute best training session you've ever had? Well try 75mg of TNE and 20mg of Superdrol both attacking you simultaneously. Then tell me that it's a "waste."

    And that's just Superdrol. Msten is also incredible injected. And epistane - hell. It's low toxicity already allows us to inject 75mg or 100mg of Epi with something like Test Prop and Tren Ace and is more potent than any Epi you've ever done before, but were afraid to triple-figure Epi.

    And Trest Ace, don't even get me started. Think Test Prop/Mast Prop/Tren Ace with Var as the kicker and Winny caps at the tail end is the "secret weapon" for shredding? Try Prop/Trest/Epi with Msten at the tail end and you'll never look back.

    Our science has evolved since the 1960's brother. We need to evolve with it.
    Last edited by blueboogie; 09-04-2013 at 08:34 PM.

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    Senior Member Right Hook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blueboogie View Post
    Oooh... You're way off brother. Don't mock it til you try it.

    So it's orally bioavailable through methylation, but does that mean it is 100% orally bioavailable? After passing through the stomach and then making a first liver pass? And then a second liver pass? This cannot be said for a single hormonal compound that I am aware of. Are you?

    Let's take Superdrol for instance, since it's a nice round number: 10mg.

    Say it's got 85% oral bioavailability, for argument's sake, which is pretty high relatively. So for every cap you ingest orally, you're getting 8.5mg. In 3 caps, you're losing 4.5mg - nearly half a cap. You're not just "losing a milligram in the tip of a syringe" out of the 250mg of Test E that it takes to put on 20lbs of lean mass (1/250 by proportion). You're losing at least 5mg out of 30mg of SD (1/6 by proportion). 1/250 vs. 1/6 - you do the math.

    But if you inject 10mg, you are getting 10mg. Inject 30mg, and you are getting 30mg (it's a base, non-esterified compound, so there is nothing lost due to ester weight).

    But what else? Don't discount the effect on your body by having a methylated compound hit your liver 200% more by orally ingesting it than by injecting it, because when you inject it, you're bypassing the first liver pass. Therefore, science tells us (as well as anecdotal reports by this point) that it is in fact less toxic. Half as toxic? Certainly not. But inarguably less toxic.

    Cliff's notes... Eat 30mg of Superdrol to get 25mg of methasteron and have your liver feel like it got hit with 30mg of methasteron. Inject 25mg of methasteron to get 25mg of methasteron and have your liver feel like it got hit with 20mg or less of methasteron.

    A waste? You're off base here brother.

    The other factor is the immediacy of kick in time when injected. Ever inject TNE and feel it begin to work in your body immediately and provide the absolute best training session you've ever had? Well try 75mg of TNE and 20mg of Superdrol both attacking you simultaneously. Then tell me that it's a "waste."

    And that's just Superdrol. Msten is also incredible injected. And epistane - hell. It's low toxicity already allows us to inject 75mg or 100mg of Epi with something like Test Prop and Tren Ace and is more potent than any Epi you've ever done before, but were afraid to triple-figure Epi.

    And Trest Ace, don't even get me started. Think Test Prop/Mast Prop/Tren Ace with Var as the kicker and Winny caps at the tail end is the "secret weapon" for shredding? Try Prop/Trest/Epi with Msten at the tail end and you'll never look back.

    Our science has evolved since the 1960's brother. We need to evolve with it.
    Whoooa brah. Strong long post of made up numbers. Literally everything from "Let's take superdrol..." to "...20mg of less of methasteron" is made up. There is no pharmacology research on superdrol. Superdrol is a terrible example anyways. Are you seriously worried about 4.5 mg's of superdrol loss (85% is a made up number btw). How much does 4.5mg's of superdrol cost? .03 cents? Probably less.

    Are you injecting designer steroids multiple times per day like you would TNE? How many pins are you using in a day? Seems like a huge waste of time and effort. Dont say things like "our science has evolved since the 60's brother". There is zero science to support anything you just wrote. If you are going to pin anything, use something good like testosterone, and trenbolone with esters.






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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Hook View Post
    Whoooa brah. Strong long post of made up numbers. Literally everything from "Let's take superdrol..." to "...20mg of less of methasteron" is made up. There is no pharmacology research on superdrol. Superdrol is a terrible example anyways. Are you seriously worried about 4.5 mg's of superdrol loss (85% is a made up number btw). How much does 4.5mg's of superdrol cost? .03 cents? Probably less.

    Are you injecting designer steroids multiple times per day like you would TNE? How many pins are you using in a day? Seems like a huge waste of time and effort. Dont say things like "our science has evolved since the 60's brother". There is zero science to support anything you just wrote. If you are going to pin anything, use something good like testosterone, and trenbolone with esters.
    Can I just fill the syringe with warm coconut oil, and mash the pills up with the plunger? Inject?Profit?...

    Gtfo
    Right Hook likes this.
    Everything said by BigCLS is for entertainment purposes and mostly fiction. BigCLS does not condone the use of any drug without the proper prescription from a doctor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Right Hook View Post
    Whoooa brah. Strong long post of made up numbers. Literally everything from "Let's take superdrol..." to "...20mg of less of methasteron" is made up. There is no pharmacology research on superdrol. Superdrol is a terrible example anyways. Are you seriously worried about 4.5 mg's of superdrol loss (85% is a made up number btw). How much does 4.5mg's of superdrol cost? .03 cents? Probably less.

    Are you injecting designer steroids multiple times per day like you would TNE? How many pins are you using in a day? Seems like a huge waste of time and effort. Dont say things like "our science has evolved since the 60's brother". There is zero science to support anything you just wrote. If you are going to pin anything, use something good like testosterone, and trenbolone with esters.
    This is why I said, "for argument's sake." It can be reasonably assumed based on the science of similar hormones that a methylated oral hormone such as Superdrol has around an 85-90% oral bioavailability.

    When you're talking about a hormone that is as effective as SD is with just 10mg, then yes, being able to take the same amount and have slightly higher bioavailability and slightly less hepatoxicity is justification enough to inject it rather than orally ingest it. Of course, I still take orals. But from my experience and experiences of clients nationwide, injecting provides stronger result with less negative sides than taking the same amount orally. If you don't like the idea, don't do it. But to call it a waste is hogwash.

    No, I don't inject more than once a day, and that once a day is sufficient. I don't inject TNE more than once a day either, and that once a day is sufficient. Could you? Sure. Should you? Why? We're talking about 24 hours, not a matter of a few days. If something has an 8 hour halflife, it's still working while you sleep if you take it first thing in the morning. There's not a significant zig zag that would make it counterintuitive.

    I don't expect this to take off amongst the large majority of BB'ers. People are still using Tren instead of MENT, Winny instead of Epi, Dbol instead of Phera. They all have their place, but some of the newer compounds blow the traditional ones away from most angles, yet people just don't believe it. But the ones open to different ideas, this is very effective for them and I am seeing incredible results amongst them on a daily basis.
    Last edited by blueboogie; 09-04-2013 at 10:24 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blueboogie View Post
    This is why I said, "for argument's sake." It can be reasonably assumed based on the science of similar hormones that a methylated oral hormone such as Superdrol has around an 85-90% oral bioavailability.

    When you're talking about a hormone that is as effective as SD is with just 10mg, then yes, being able to take the same amount and have slightly higher bioavailability and slightly less hepatoxicity is justification enough to inject it rather than orally ingest it. Of course, I still take orals. But from my experience and experiences of clients nationwide, injecting provides stronger result with less negative sides than taking the same amount orally. If you don't like the idea, don't do it. But to call it a waste is hogwash.

    No, I don't inject more than once a day, and that once a day is sufficient. I don't inject TNE more than once a day either, and that once a day is sufficient. Could you? Sure. Should you? Why? We're talking about 24 hours, not a matter of a few days. If something has an 8 hour halflife, it's still working while you sleep if you take it first thing in the morning. There's not a significant zig zag that would make it counterintuitive.

    I don't expect this to take off amongst the large majority of BB'ers. People are still using Tren instead of MENT, Winny instead of Epi, Dbol instead of Phera. They all have their place, but some of the newer compounds blow the traditional ones away from most angles, yet people just don't believe it. But the ones open to different ideas, this is very effective for them and I am seeing incredible results amongst them on a daily basis.
    For argument's sake let's just make up some numbers "Clients nationwide" Translation "I'm a drug dealer. I need to sell this stuff."






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    I'll just agree to disagree with you. I put a lot of thought and experience into a post, only to have you respond with a cute little picture and unfounded cynicism. Least you could do is come at me with some kind of supported argument, even if you perceive that my numerical estimations are baseless in theory. And by the way, one of the points of putting things like Epi and Msten and Trest into injectable form is to have a legally sound product. That's not drug dealing, unless we want to call anyone who sells epistane a drug dealer. It's a legal raw powder combined with legal preservatives, solvents, carrier oils inside of a legal vial for purposes of performing a legal act. That's not drug dealing. But you probably have another cute picture as an intelligent retort.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blueboogie View Post
    I'll just agree to disagree with you. I put a lot of thought and experience into a post, only to have you respond with a cute little picture and unfounded cynicism. Least you could do is come at me with some kind of supported argument, even if you perceive that my numerical estimations are baseless in theory. And by the way, one of the points of putting things like Epi and Msten and Trest into injectable form is to have a legally sound product. That's not drug dealing, unless we want to call anyone who sells epistane a drug dealer. It's a legal raw powder combined with legal preservatives, solvents, carrier oils inside of a legal vial for purposes of performing a legal act. That's not drug dealing. But you probably have another cute picture as an intelligent retort.
    You're selling injectable steroids. SuperDrol is a controlled substance. You are a drug dealer.






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    The OP posted with some questions about this very topic, and I contributed what I know about the subject matter. It may not jive with what you believe, but you're not providing any support for your cynicism, so you resort to accusations and name calling. How old are you? Nevermind - I'm done with you. You have nothing useful to contribute to the thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blueboogie View Post
    The OP posted with some questions about this very topic, and I contributed what I know about the subject matter. It may not jive with what you believe, but you're not providing any support for your cynicism, so you resort to accusations and name calling. How old are you? Nevermind - I'm done with you. You have nothing useful to contribute to the thread.
    I'm sorry you're upset. If people want to waste their time and money on injectable designer steroid bases then by all means they should. Meanwhile anyone with a reasonable amount of intelligence can just consume them orally as they were designed to be based on sound, long standing, pharmacology research.






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    Quote Originally Posted by blueboogie View Post
    Oooh... You're way off brother. Don't mock it til you try it.

    So it's orally bioavailable through methylation, but does that mean it is 100% orally bioavailable? After passing through the stomach and then making a first liver pass? And then a second liver pass? This cannot be said for a single hormonal compound that I am aware of. Are you?

    Let's take Superdrol for instance, since it's a nice round number: 10mg.

    Say it's got 85% oral bioavailability, for argument's sake, which is pretty high relatively. So for every cap you ingest orally, you're getting 8.5mg. In 3 caps, you're losing 4.5mg - nearly half a cap. You're not just "losing a milligram in the tip of a syringe" out of the 250mg of Test E that it takes to put on 20lbs of lean mass (1/250 by proportion). You're losing at least 5mg out of 30mg of SD (1/6 by proportion). 1/250 vs. 1/6 - you do the math.

    But if you inject 10mg, you are getting 10mg. Inject 30mg, and you are getting 30mg (it's a base, non-esterified compound, so there is nothing lost due to ester weight).

    But what else? Don't discount the effect on your body by having a methylated compound hit your liver 200% more by orally ingesting it than by injecting it, because when you inject it, you're bypassing the first liver pass. Therefore, science tells us (as well as anecdotal reports by this point) that it is in fact less toxic. Half as toxic? Certainly not. But inarguably less toxic.

    Cliff's notes... Eat 30mg of Superdrol to get 25mg of methasteron and have your liver feel like it got hit with 30mg of methasteron. Inject 25mg of methasteron to get 25mg of methasteron and have your liver feel like it got hit with 20mg or less of methasteron.

    A waste? You're off base here brother.

    The other factor is the immediacy of kick in time when injected. Ever inject TNE and feel it begin to work in your body immediately and provide the absolute best training session you've ever had? Well try 75mg of TNE and 20mg of Superdrol both attacking you simultaneously. Then tell me that it's a "waste."

    And that's just Superdrol. Msten is also incredible injected. And epistane - hell. It's low toxicity already allows us to inject 75mg or 100mg of Epi with something like Test Prop and Tren Ace and is more potent than any Epi you've ever done before, but were afraid to triple-figure Epi.

    And Trest Ace, don't even get me started. Think Test Prop/Mast Prop/Tren Ace with Var as the kicker and Winny caps at the tail end is the "secret weapon" for shredding? Try Prop/Trest/Epi with Msten at the tail end and you'll never look back.

    Our science has evolved since the 1960's brother. We need to evolve with it.
    Jesus this is horrible logic. Even if its more efficient injected, just take more orally. They are cheap.

    This is like mad-bro-scientist home wrong lol
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    *TRex [at] seriousnutritionsolutions.com*

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    Quote Originally Posted by TRex View Post
    Jesus this is horrible logic. Even if its more efficient injected, just take more orally. They are cheap.

    This is like mad-bro-scientist home wrong lol
    The figures are very rough estimates, but do have some foundation. Nobody can tell us specific figures, not even PA or Henryv. Believe me, I've grilled them. What they will tell you is in line with what I am telling you - they are slightly more potent IM, and slightly less toxic IM. So even if it's just a little bit, it's something. Why do we use TUDCA (and why did the old school guys use milk thistle?)? To protect against the hepatoxicity of these particular hormones. If we can reduce the hepatoxicity even slightly simply by adjusting the delivery method, then that's a win in itself, even if they weren't any more potent that way. But here, we have a win-win, since the best minds in the industry agree that they are slightly less toxic and slightly more potent. I'm certainly not one of the best minds in the industry, but I can take what I learn from those individuals and apply it to what I do already know. And if you have access to raw powders, it is significantly cheaper to do it IM than it is to do it orally. I don't see a down side, and trust me, I've done the homework. It's not just a flip decision for me to make my own IM's from legally obtained raws of methylated and other compounds. I wouldn't do it if it wasn't worth it or if it was a "waste." And if it wasn't amazingly effective, then I wouldn't continue doing it. Different strokes for different folks, and this one works for me. Very well so.

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    Not trying to stir the pot but injectable dbol and winny are no different than their oral counterparts as far as toxicity and potency are concerned. Blood work shows this. It doesn't matter if you eat it or inject it, your liver still has to metabolize it.

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    Everything said by BigCLS is for entertainment purposes and mostly fiction. BigCLS does not condone the use of any drug without the proper prescription from a doctor.

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    where is that nagger at??

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    Quote Originally Posted by blueboogie View Post
    The figures are very rough estimates, but do have some foundation. Nobody can tell us specific figures, not even PA or Henryv. Believe me, I've grilled them. What they will tell you is in line with what I am telling you - they are slightly more potent IM, and slightly less toxic IM. So even if it's just a little bit, it's something. Why do we use TUDCA (and why did the old school guys use milk thistle?)? To protect against the hepatoxicity of these particular hormones. If we can reduce the hepatoxicity even slightly simply by adjusting the delivery method, then that's a win in itself, even if they weren't any more potent that way. But here, we have a win-win, since the best minds in the industry agree that they are slightly less toxic and slightly more potent. I'm certainly not one of the best minds in the industry, but I can take what I learn from those individuals and apply it to what I do already know. And if you have access to raw powders, it is significantly cheaper to do it IM than it is to do it orally. I don't see a down side, and trust me, I've done the homework. It's not just a flip decision for me to make my own IM's from legally obtained raws of methylated and other compounds. I wouldn't do it if it wasn't worth it or if it was a "waste." And if it wasn't amazingly effective, then I wouldn't continue doing it. Different strokes for different folks, and this one works for me. Very well so.
    You are so full of shit. If it's a little bit, it's a huge fucking waste of time. The old school guys would have used TUDCA but it wasnt available. Instead they just didnt use it, and ran normal reasonable cycles. Btw, TUDCA is used to treat cholestasis in the medical community, not treat it. Send me some of your msten powder, I will have it tested for superdrol. Let's see how legal it really is...
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    This thread is like trying to add the edges back to the wheel..
    Everything said by BigCLS is for entertainment purposes and mostly fiction. BigCLS does not condone the use of any drug without the proper prescription from a doctor.

 

 

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